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#1 SassySue09

SassySue09

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  • Interests:my cars, my friends and having fun with both of them.
  • Year: year_1987
  • Make:Pontiac
  • Model: Formula
  • Engine:carbed 305
  • Transmission:700R4
  • Modifications:
    '79 Carmine Red Formula with red interior; 301 with an automatic; all original and matching numbers; totally stock and going to stay that way too. In the process of restoring it but it's still on the road and running strong. #2280 of Formulas built that year.

    '87 Bright Red Formula - 02 leather corvette seats; Pioneer triple face headunit w/remote; PS2; 10 speakers (RF and Pioneer); 2 12" subs in custom build sub box; preamp; amp; metered cap; 02 Chevy Exteme rims; Flowmaster 50 series custom catback; TransGo stage 2 shift kit; K&N air filter; engine - original carbed 305 being swapped for a custom built 355.

    '97 Black T/A - auto; Magnaflow catback; air foil; March overdrive and underdrive pullies; B&M stage 2 shift kit; K&N air filter; 02 WS6 rims; SunCoast ram air hood; 3.42 gears; custom hood bird; anodized purple interior and engine bay details

    '99 Navy Blue Metallic T/A - auto; Magnaflow catback; Comp Cam; beehive springs; upgraded pushrods, retainers, rocker arms; LS6 intake; Pacesetter LT headers and ORY; TCI extreme street 3600 stall; K&N air filter; EGR and Air Pump delete; 3.23 gears; Eagle Alloy 077 17" rims; SLP line lock; C.A.M. tune, dynoed at 370 rwhp/379 rwtorque

Posted 29 June 2005 - 05:20 AM

Just thought I'd warn everyone who is thinking of getting tuning done to avoid More Performance Inc in Charlotte North Carolina.

I had my 99 fairly heavily modded and took it to More Performance Inc to get it tuned. They supposedly done a good job but my car wasn't running what it should have been at the track with the mods and tuning that were done to it or how it should have been in general. I had several people I know take a look at it, drive it, look at the dyno sheet from More and they all told me that something wasn't right with the tune. We thought it was the shift points for one, since they seemed to be still stock. But I was also having issues with my car when I first started it (I had to tach it up to 1500rpm for about 2 minutes or until the cars temp gauge hit around 100 before it would stay running and not die on me.) And around 35mph I was having a slight surging problem. Both of these problems I was told shouldn't be happening if the tune was done correctly. I was also having some other minor problems with it as well.

Well I ended up taking my car to Carolina Auto Masters and Jeff Creech to get it retuned since I was in North Carolina and he came highly recommended by several people I know. Once Jeff got to looking at my car and the tune that More Performance had done I'm surprised my car even ran!!!!!! More Performance had turned on some of the tables that should have been off, turned off some that should have been on, set my IAC settings to fully open (the cause of my start up issue), didn't adjust some of the tables that needed to be adjusted, over adjusted other tables, etc. To set things right, Jeff Creech had to take my cars tuning almost back to stock and start over again to fix what More Performance had messed up and to get everything set the way it should be for the mods that I have done to it. Jeff and I even took the car for 4 test drives to make sure that the rev limiter and shift points were at the correct positions (something that needs to be done and which More didn't do. mad.gif ).

So after 3 1/2 - 4 hours worth of retuning by Jeff Creech at Carolina Auto Masters, I now have a car that runs the way that it should with the mods done to it and all the issues that I had been having after More Performances tune are gone. It's like driving a completely different car now. biggrin.gif

So I HIGHLY suggest that you avoid More Performance Inc for any tuning that you need done and to go to Carolina Auto Masters and it's owner Jeff Creech if you do need tuning.

Yes they're all mine and no I'm not crazy.

Having problems with something on the site please contact me: click here

#2 Pyro97

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    CC503 cam, PS LT's, Hooker catback, 2800 converter, 3.73 gears, Herron Performance tune, BMR torque arm/STB/DS loop, Spohn LCA's, LS1 DS, Kenny Brown DD SFC's, and various supporting mods

Posted 29 June 2005 - 05:39 AM

I've heard a lot of good things about Jeff. I was planning to take my car up there but I decided to go with a mail order tune because I didn't want to drive up there and find out I needed to replace a part, so I just decided to save the money and get a dyno tune later when I had more done.
1997 Triple White Firebird Formula Convertible
1994 Blue Camaro Z28 hardtop -Sold
1997 Teal GMC Sierra Z71 Ext. Cab
and a bunch of Olds stuff

#3 SassySue09

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  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Belleville, IL/St. Louis, MO
  • Interests:my cars, my friends and having fun with both of them.
  • Year: year_1987
  • Make:Pontiac
  • Model: Formula
  • Engine:carbed 305
  • Transmission:700R4
  • Modifications:
    '79 Carmine Red Formula with red interior; 301 with an automatic; all original and matching numbers; totally stock and going to stay that way too. In the process of restoring it but it's still on the road and running strong. #2280 of Formulas built that year.

    '87 Bright Red Formula - 02 leather corvette seats; Pioneer triple face headunit w/remote; PS2; 10 speakers (RF and Pioneer); 2 12" subs in custom build sub box; preamp; amp; metered cap; 02 Chevy Exteme rims; Flowmaster 50 series custom catback; TransGo stage 2 shift kit; K&N air filter; engine - original carbed 305 being swapped for a custom built 355.

    '97 Black T/A - auto; Magnaflow catback; air foil; March overdrive and underdrive pullies; B&M stage 2 shift kit; K&N air filter; 02 WS6 rims; SunCoast ram air hood; 3.42 gears; custom hood bird; anodized purple interior and engine bay details

    '99 Navy Blue Metallic T/A - auto; Magnaflow catback; Comp Cam; beehive springs; upgraded pushrods, retainers, rocker arms; LS6 intake; Pacesetter LT headers and ORY; TCI extreme street 3600 stall; K&N air filter; EGR and Air Pump delete; 3.23 gears; Eagle Alloy 077 17" rims; SLP line lock; C.A.M. tune, dynoed at 370 rwhp/379 rwtorque

Posted 29 June 2005 - 06:05 AM

That's cool about you doing the mail in tune. I've heard he does wonders with them too.

I would have done that myself, but since I was in the area anyway and with all the issues I was having it was just as easy for me to go to see him to get it done and make sure that everything was right and that More Perf. hadn't messed up anything else.

Yes they're all mine and no I'm not crazy.

Having problems with something on the site please contact me: click here

#4 SassySue09

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  • Location:Belleville, IL/St. Louis, MO
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  • Year: year_1987
  • Make:Pontiac
  • Model: Formula
  • Engine:carbed 305
  • Transmission:700R4
  • Modifications:
    '79 Carmine Red Formula with red interior; 301 with an automatic; all original and matching numbers; totally stock and going to stay that way too. In the process of restoring it but it's still on the road and running strong. #2280 of Formulas built that year.

    '87 Bright Red Formula - 02 leather corvette seats; Pioneer triple face headunit w/remote; PS2; 10 speakers (RF and Pioneer); 2 12" subs in custom build sub box; preamp; amp; metered cap; 02 Chevy Exteme rims; Flowmaster 50 series custom catback; TransGo stage 2 shift kit; K&N air filter; engine - original carbed 305 being swapped for a custom built 355.

    '97 Black T/A - auto; Magnaflow catback; air foil; March overdrive and underdrive pullies; B&M stage 2 shift kit; K&N air filter; 02 WS6 rims; SunCoast ram air hood; 3.42 gears; custom hood bird; anodized purple interior and engine bay details

    '99 Navy Blue Metallic T/A - auto; Magnaflow catback; Comp Cam; beehive springs; upgraded pushrods, retainers, rocker arms; LS6 intake; Pacesetter LT headers and ORY; TCI extreme street 3600 stall; K&N air filter; EGR and Air Pump delete; 3.23 gears; Eagle Alloy 077 17" rims; SLP line lock; C.A.M. tune, dynoed at 370 rwhp/379 rwtorque

Posted 29 June 2005 - 06:52 AM

I'd also like to add a couple of things.

1) At More Performance they didn't let me see anything that they were doing when they tuned my car. They just asked me a few questions and then had me wait in a waiting area. Plus the numbers they gave me for the rear were off cause of where they tune the cars and how they get the numbers. They tune the cars in an air conditioned area that is humidity controlled also. Plus both sets of numbers they gave me were with my stall locked, not one locked and one unlocked.

2) When I went to C.A.M., Jeff asked me a whole lots of questions, asked me what my car was doing that didn't feel right or was messing up before he even touched my car. Then he did a baseline pull to see what was up numberwise with the tune from More Perf. With my car sitting in a non-air conditioned building and the convertor unlocked, like it should be, the actual numbers I was making at the rear were 330rwph/340rwtorque. Those are alot different then More lead me to believe and gave me, which were 383rwhp/372rwtorque. blink.gif

3) Right from the beginning Jeff not only told me but let me sit there and watch what he was doing tunewise on the computer before he sent the info to my car and kept me completely informed of what was working, not working, what needed to be adjusted some more and why it needed to be adjusted, etc. He didn't keep me in the dark about anything that he done, unlike More Performance, which gave me a better understanding of what my car should be doing, why it should be doing it and just better confidence in his ability to do the job right.

4) So, now after all of this, here are my new number at the rear, with both the stall unlocked and locked:

unlocked: 356.1rwhp/340.1rwtorque
locked: 370.8rwhp/376.7rwtorque

To me those numbers look a whole lot nicer knowing that they're real world (actual outside temp and humidity) numbers rather then numbers put down by my car in an air conditioned room cause who runs their cars down an air conditioned track? I know I don't.

Yes they're all mine and no I'm not crazy.

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#5 SiberianFirestorm

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Posted 29 June 2005 - 02:37 PM

CAM is one of the best in the area. I have heard lots of bad things for More Performance.

Jeff is almost famous for his tunes here in Myrtle Beach. Does an awsome job.

Glad you got it figured out and nice numbers by the way.

Matt
It is better to appear stupid then to open your mouth and remove all doubt.
Steal all that you can, yet take nothing. -- Simply put, if someone is willing to teach you, then be willing to learn and appreciate it.

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1990 Formula T-Top A4

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#6 Shaun Barcelow

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  • Year: year_1994
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  • Model: Formula
  • Engine:5.7 Liter LT-1
  • Transmission:4L60-E
  • Modifications:
    Lingenfelter SuperTube Cold Air Induction System & LT4 knock module (ie. nearly stock)

Posted 29 June 2005 - 03:25 PM

QUOTE(SassySue09 @ Jun 29 2005, 01:20 AM)
...when I first started it (I had to tach it up to 1500rpm for about 2 minutes or until the cars temp gauge hit around 100 before it would stay running and not die on me.)...

...More Performance had turned on some of the tables that should have been off, turned off some that should have been on, set my IAC settings to fully open (the cause of my start up issue)...

I always thought that open loop operation was based on mechanical defaults of fuel/air ratios, etc. It sounds like, even in open loop, the PCM is monitoring sensors and electronically tailoring fuel curves, timing, etc. based on that information. Is that true? (It must be if your startup problem is solved.)
1994 Pontiac Firebird Formula, metallic dark green, 4L60-E, 3.23 gears, performance tire option, best 1/4 mile = 14.27 (Oct '94), top speed (Nov '94): 149 MPH (gauge)...Mods to date (May '03): Lingenfelter SuperTube Cold Air Induction System & LT4 knock module.

2007 Pontiac Grand Prix, metallic dark blue (my daily driver).

2003 GMC Envoy SLT, metallic light green (my wife's truck).

1977 Donzi 16 Ski Sporter, white and orange (our sport boat), 350 Chevy ZZ4, Volvo Penta 270 outdrive, top speed (June '08): 59 MPH (GPS).


#7 SassySue09

SassySue09

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  • Location:Belleville, IL/St. Louis, MO
  • Interests:my cars, my friends and having fun with both of them.
  • Year: year_1987
  • Make:Pontiac
  • Model: Formula
  • Engine:carbed 305
  • Transmission:700R4
  • Modifications:
    '79 Carmine Red Formula with red interior; 301 with an automatic; all original and matching numbers; totally stock and going to stay that way too. In the process of restoring it but it's still on the road and running strong. #2280 of Formulas built that year.

    '87 Bright Red Formula - 02 leather corvette seats; Pioneer triple face headunit w/remote; PS2; 10 speakers (RF and Pioneer); 2 12" subs in custom build sub box; preamp; amp; metered cap; 02 Chevy Exteme rims; Flowmaster 50 series custom catback; TransGo stage 2 shift kit; K&N air filter; engine - original carbed 305 being swapped for a custom built 355.

    '97 Black T/A - auto; Magnaflow catback; air foil; March overdrive and underdrive pullies; B&M stage 2 shift kit; K&N air filter; 02 WS6 rims; SunCoast ram air hood; 3.42 gears; custom hood bird; anodized purple interior and engine bay details

    '99 Navy Blue Metallic T/A - auto; Magnaflow catback; Comp Cam; beehive springs; upgraded pushrods, retainers, rocker arms; LS6 intake; Pacesetter LT headers and ORY; TCI extreme street 3600 stall; K&N air filter; EGR and Air Pump delete; 3.23 gears; Eagle Alloy 077 17" rims; SLP line lock; C.A.M. tune, dynoed at 370 rwhp/379 rwtorque

Posted 29 June 2005 - 05:11 PM

I'm not quite sure which sensors and stuff are monitored at startup. All I do know is that with the way that More Perf had the IAC sensor set up it was causing the PCM to "think" that the hole on the TB that can be drilled bigger was drilled out to 1/4" (which is WAY to big btw) when in actuality the hole is the stock size and has never been drilled out and that the throttle plate was all the way open. So with the PCM thinking that there was that much air flowing through the TB with the IAC set to fully open, it was trying to compensate for a much larger amount of air coming in when really just the normal amount of air was flowing through. So with that happening the PCM couldn't compensate for the extra air since it wasn't getting a larger amount to begin with which was causing my cold start/open loop startup issue. Then once the car went into closed loop a different part of the table for the IAC was read which More Perf hadn't messed with which is why after I had tached up the car for about two minutes it started to idle fine.

I sure hope all of that makes sense. blink.gif

Yes they're all mine and no I'm not crazy.

Having problems with something on the site please contact me: click here

#8 Shaun Barcelow

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  • Year: year_1994
  • Make:Pontiac
  • Model: Formula
  • Engine:5.7 Liter LT-1
  • Transmission:4L60-E
  • Modifications:
    Lingenfelter SuperTube Cold Air Induction System & LT4 knock module (ie. nearly stock)

Posted 29 June 2005 - 06:16 PM

It does. And I wasn't doubting you (for the record). It's just new information for me. It makes sense, though, that there would be some electronic influence even during open loop operation.
1994 Pontiac Firebird Formula, metallic dark green, 4L60-E, 3.23 gears, performance tire option, best 1/4 mile = 14.27 (Oct '94), top speed (Nov '94): 149 MPH (gauge)...Mods to date (May '03): Lingenfelter SuperTube Cold Air Induction System & LT4 knock module.

2007 Pontiac Grand Prix, metallic dark blue (my daily driver).

2003 GMC Envoy SLT, metallic light green (my wife's truck).

1977 Donzi 16 Ski Sporter, white and orange (our sport boat), 350 Chevy ZZ4, Volvo Penta 270 outdrive, top speed (June '08): 59 MPH (GPS).


#9 SassySue09

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  • Location:Belleville, IL/St. Louis, MO
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  • Year: year_1987
  • Make:Pontiac
  • Model: Formula
  • Engine:carbed 305
  • Transmission:700R4
  • Modifications:
    '79 Carmine Red Formula with red interior; 301 with an automatic; all original and matching numbers; totally stock and going to stay that way too. In the process of restoring it but it's still on the road and running strong. #2280 of Formulas built that year.

    '87 Bright Red Formula - 02 leather corvette seats; Pioneer triple face headunit w/remote; PS2; 10 speakers (RF and Pioneer); 2 12" subs in custom build sub box; preamp; amp; metered cap; 02 Chevy Exteme rims; Flowmaster 50 series custom catback; TransGo stage 2 shift kit; K&N air filter; engine - original carbed 305 being swapped for a custom built 355.

    '97 Black T/A - auto; Magnaflow catback; air foil; March overdrive and underdrive pullies; B&M stage 2 shift kit; K&N air filter; 02 WS6 rims; SunCoast ram air hood; 3.42 gears; custom hood bird; anodized purple interior and engine bay details

    '99 Navy Blue Metallic T/A - auto; Magnaflow catback; Comp Cam; beehive springs; upgraded pushrods, retainers, rocker arms; LS6 intake; Pacesetter LT headers and ORY; TCI extreme street 3600 stall; K&N air filter; EGR and Air Pump delete; 3.23 gears; Eagle Alloy 077 17" rims; SLP line lock; C.A.M. tune, dynoed at 370 rwhp/379 rwtorque

Posted 29 June 2005 - 06:30 PM

That's cool. I didn't think you were doubting me but I figured I'd explain better why my car was doing what it was doing with the IAC table set the way it was.

Yes they're all mine and no I'm not crazy.

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#10 Formyla

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  • Year: year_2000
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Posted 29 June 2005 - 07:42 PM

Ok so its "No More!" blink.gif wink.gif

It's a real bummer when you have to spend good money for bad service mad.gif




02 Z28
06 Vortex Max
79 T/A
2000 Formie - sold but still well taken care of

#11 imnotplutonium

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Posted 08 August 2005 - 03:42 PM

wow, glad to hear you got out of that mess with your car not really getting hurt! Hey does anyone here know of a good tune place in the houston area?
User posted image

1994 red formula A4, t-tops. MSD ignition box and coil, taylor over the valve cover kit, slp cold air intake, autometer gauges, Pacesetter Longtubes, O.R.Y., magnaflow cat-back, pullies, b&m trans cooler, bmr sub-frame connectors, spohn strut tower brace, spohn lca's, lt4 knock module, air foil, resonator delete plug, !first gear stopper, mba billet t.b. plate (black) with phoenix engraved, mba billet auto shift knob (black) phoenix engraved, chrome 17" c5 wheels wrapped in yokohama rubbers :)

#12 scrmnws6

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Posted 08 August 2005 - 03:53 PM

Glad to hear everything turned out great! Gonna have the bird at Nationals?


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Check out my fquick garage!!!

#13 screamingchicken

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Posted 09 August 2005 - 01:11 PM

Roger Vinci @Vinci Hi-Performance does our tuning he's in the Orlando area..... He is the one that does the "GTX" package for the Grand Prix GTP's.......and it's covered under the Pontiac warranty....kinda like SLP for Grand Prixs. He does alot of LS6 packages now. He was big into the Lt1 and Ls1 motors in the 90's. My dad used to get his car modded by Vinci back in the good ole days.............so he's been around a turn or two. wink.gif


Glad to here that you got your car tuned right Sue..........hopefully 'mo-performance will be running themselves outta business. huh.gif

Dennis
1995 Formula Convertible M6, White with factory red leather, Black top. All modifications in 1997 with 39,000 miles.

"...yes officer, I know EXACTLY how fast I was going, along with what gear I was in, and what RPM I was at. Did I do something that you didn't like?"

"....YES, we still have the Formula!"
"....NO, we will NEVER sell it!"

"...I'm not going fast! Everyone else is just going slow!!"




Good luck to you too there buddy!
Dennis

#14 KRockLS1

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Posted 09 August 2005 - 06:39 PM

glad to hear everything turned out OK. Sue, perhaps you should thrown an email to the better business bureau, just to try and keep others from experiencing the same run-around you got. It's up to you, but it is an option.
Kevin Rock
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#15 Formyla

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  • Year: year_2000
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  • Engine:LS1
  • Transmission:A4
  • Modifications:
    Shaner T3 TB, Hooker coated long tubes, Hooker catback w/ Aerochamber muff, Stock Formie tips :), Some poly bushings, 1LE front sway bar, Baer erradi speeds up front, Hawk pads, SS brake lines, Trans cooler, Accel Kool Blue air filter, SLP smooth bellows, SLP lid, Castrol 0w30 Syntec, Amsoil synthetic media oil filter, AMW pcv catch can, www.PCMforless.com PCM tune, LPE 3.5 aluminum Drive shaft, Slot Car racing Panhard rod and LCR's, Moser 3:73's, Amsoil extream gear synth lube, 160' thermostat, Free mods - free ram air, TB coolant BP, C5 Vette wheels, Kumho Ecstica? 275/35/18 all 4 corners, Birds embroidered in Head rests, SLP TC reverse switch.

Posted 10 August 2005 - 03:41 AM

QUOTE
Hey does anyone here know of a good tune place in the houston area?


Lots of Texas guys come over here to


futral motor sports

in Walker, LA - just the other side of Baton Rouge rolleyes.gif




02 Z28
06 Vortex Max
79 T/A
2000 Formie - sold but still well taken care of

#16 DanielChick

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#17 Payday

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#19 RogerAxoke

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RogerAxoke

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RogerAxoke

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#22 RogerAxoke

RogerAxoke

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RogerAxoke

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Armandolyday

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